Club rules, site rules, and legalities

random thought,

Should we change the player tags (NIA member, new player etc) to just say where people are playing and get rid of the member piece of it? They would just say "Prince George" or "100 Mile House" something like that....We can keep the admin ones so people know who to talk to for changes to the site.

That is a great idea...one of the comments I have had given to me, is how do I find people in my area, when I visit the NIA Site... and that change would help with that.

Is there a way way we can also create a membership group for each area? Or show a roster per area?

I think unless a local happens to post something, new people can't really see or find their neighboor players.

I noticed that I can pm a group of people and that is what made me think of grouping people somehow by location.

Otherwise NIA website becomes a melting pot instead of the 'mosiac' we Canadians are so proud of.

The waiver looks perfect! I also like the idea of changing the tags from NIA member to regional locations.

Thanks to everyone for working this out and thanks to Mike and Chris for updating the waiver to something that we can all work with. I think a lot of our problems with attracting people from other clubs to our site is because we differentiated between members and non-members and tried to push our rules on other teams. If someone from FSJ wanted to post a game and invite us they had to play by our rules which a lot of them didn't agree with. By having the option to post their games with their own rules they will have more incentive to participate in the NIA forums.

Thanks TW.

Here is a revision, now with INSTRUCTIONS! (page 4)

http://airsoft/airsoftbc.com/legal/hold_harmless_Airsoft_Waiver_draft_f.pdf

We used to keep a roster of players in PG but things got to big and I gave up. (it was getting up past 60 names).

Play around with the usergroups at the top and you should be able to make a group and call it whatever you want. Just sticky instructions on how to joing the group in the 100 mile spot and the people will end up in the right spot.

I'll ask again, what is an NIA member then? Is it up to each area to say who is a member of their local group?
Quote from above.
This would make the NIA the site where we gather and nothing more correct? When people play 5 games and own gear should we still sell the badges and officially welcome them as members of the site?

Ah, this is another question, and a worthy one. I will have to think more on that.

Edit:
And after a day wrestling with the dryness of waiver niceties, finally rewarded by an evening beverage (maybe 2) while battling a 5 year old during a movie of "Musketeer" the question of 'what is a NIA patch wearer' is placed in an interesting light.

What is an NIA patchwearer now? Own your own weapons and attend enough games. Or a member of the website? (Both of these things have their OWN reward, do they not?)

Or is this just the measure of an active Prince George member? Is that enough? Who SHOULD be entitled to the wearing of the Moosehead?

With imbibed echos of "all for one" ringing distantly within the walls of my small winter besieged home, and the feats and challenges of D'Artagnan pulling him here and there supporting the values of a musketeer, I wonder if it was his owning his sword that gave him the glad company of his fellows? Or the number of his past skirmishes? Was it the ownership of his horse? Or his wiliness to dare the odds that gave him the right to wear the BLUE?

Was it his taking the path less traveled, with the dust of the road well earned? Was it his actions beyond his scope of close friends, and in support of his organization as a whole?

What is the values of an Northern Interior Airsoft member? What would make them different from a Kamloops member...or a Op-For member? Indeed this question demands another. What is the value of the NIA?

There IS something very special about being a part something larger that just your area, so I pose these questions with that 'something' very much in mind.

But if I was the one asked "How am I to earn to right to display the moose?", what would be MY response?

I would tell them that it must be given to them by someone from outside their area.

THAT is what makes a NIA patch wearer different from any other group....or in the words of the Arrogant Worms...'cause Canada's really big"!

Or in this case the NIA. And like Canada, it is varied in its climates, terrain, people, and outlooks. That variety of this group, if supported, could be its strength, instead an opprtunity for disagreement and conflict. (More on that in a bit).

It could be worn as a sign that you will support the entire NIA, not just your area.

The moose on that good looking patch is an amazing example of strength that can range for hundreds of miles.

In a more military tone, the strength of a force is NOT as important as the projection to the enemy OF that force. If you do not PROJECT force, you have effectively decided to skip the war and stay home. No matter your abilities. Should that earn a patch?

If one does not travel and skirmish with those outside your area, how do you improve your individual skill set, as opposed to just getting more familiar with your friends abilities and how to overcome that (or not). How do you keep the excitement of combat fresh and interesting? How do you recharge your game organizers when they grow tired of inventing new challenges and start to remember the days when they were a simple player? Or their first game?

I know I have locals here, better players than I, who having played for many years, have grown tired of just another game, and have begun to see their regular weekend game of Airsoft as just another obligation, strangely perk up when talk of an airsoft road-trip is made. They briefly light up as well when new players show up, but soon fade again under their regular regime.

I believe that only through travel and giving the gift of glad arms to our fellow NIA folk afar, does the individual combatant improve and as well only in this case, does the NIA value as a whole, be seen. Seen by the wearer and others who might see the example made and be glad of their membership in the NIA.

Thats what the patch COULD mean. IF we wanted it to.

whew. thats alot for one morning! As a badged NIA member (although I've not played in a long time) I fully support the above changes...changing references to 'NIA rules'; eliminating any NIA 'control'; placing control at the local level; and keeping current signed waivers. I will participate in local games following any specific game safety rules and will sign any waivers neccesary.

In short, I agree that we shall reduce the liability on any individual; including my own and especially Dave's; and create an environment where an individual actually really truly does legally assume ALL personal liability; and where safe play is guaranteed.

I see that the badge may have to diminish in importance primarily so as to reduce the validity of an entity that can be sued (--is this correct?). It may just mean 'I play in this region with other cool people'. It is 'earned' simply by location, association, equipment and proven safe play etc. I think this is what Mikhail said; it's significance is when a mooseheaded NIA participates in other areas--then that member serves as a general example of the rest of this community. And I hope--nay, expect!-- an example of safety and integrity that will encourage others to travel here to participate with us.

Anyway, ignore me if I am out to lunch as i usually am. My excuse is I have a cold.

And I've said this privately now publicly; Mikhail (and Chris); you have contributed immensley to the sport of Airsoft. Thank you. Dave; you have brought the sport a very long way with your energy, enthusiasm and willingness to take on the lead. A HUGE thank you. Now step away from the liablity dude.

Ok, I THINK this is a good final copy. Here is a pdf AND a doc copy that can be edited by game organizers electronically for their games.

Choose this if you are printing it out and filling in by hand(It will print better):
http://legal.airsoftbc.com/Hold_Harmless_Airsoft_Waiver.pdf

Choose this if you are editing the file directly using MS Word or Open Office:
http://legal.airsoftbc.com/hold_harmless_Airsoft_Waiver.doc

This should be moved and stickied for ease of access.

Done

things I have done.

-stickied this topic
-deleted NIA from event and briefing forums
-changed area event descriptions...I may have had to much fun
-changed permissions so non admins can post thread in events sections (if you are an admin it would be worth checking what I did and making it what you want it to be)
-written a line into the "how do I become a member" thread
-stickied and locked the old NIA rules

https://pgairsoft.forumotion.com/t142-not-in-use-northern-interior-airsoft-rules#924
https://pgairsoft.forumotion.com/Frequently-Asked-Airsoft-Questions-f26/How-do-I-join-the-club-t585.htm

I was thinking of creating a sub forum for hosts/event locations to post their own guidlines but because each area in now just on their own I figured it is probably best for the hosts in each area to post in their own briefing section. They can create the space they want so if players want to see what the rules are for each area they simply just need to look in that areas briefing section. THoughts?

As areas are now responsible for themselves solely I think it's safe for each area/host to start posting their content. Lots of the discussion that we have going in this thread is now just up to the players in that area to figure out. If it's up to the host as the what guidelines they want to follow would it not also be up to them what waiver they use and if they even want to use a waiver? I am very interested in keeping the waiver discussion going but should we just start a new thread for it?

It's past 1am...I hope I didn't make any late night boo boos when changing the forum!

I just changed some of the hidden site description to include all the town names so that google has an easier time finding us.

As i am late to the party i don't expect my voice to go 'heard' so to speak. i speak for the interested airsofter who in honesty, has no clue about legalities and just enjoy heading out and having a good time.

i agree that this airsoft club has gained in popularity and size over the past few years and in such the 'don't worry about anything' trust circle will not cut it anymore. i agree wholeheartedly with this whole forum string. although I'm having to agree with a seasonal wavier as well. the signing of a waiver for each game is (i think) a little intense. although it specifically outlines the activities for such date.

i say, do the seasonal waiver. have the normal recurring players who are not members be made to sign the seasonal waivers at the first cqc/outdoor game. make any renters or first time players be made to sign the seasonal waiver before they can play.

in my mind that makes sure that the legalities are taken care of but doesn't choke the setup for each game. the "did everyone sign their waiver" just before game co-ordinator goes over game rules and specifics seems a little... i dunno.. legal lol?

if required, maybe members who have signed the waiver should keep a copy of the waiver with them when they go to a game, like in their back pack or gun case. so that all they'd have to do is flash it to the game co-ordinater and be done with it?

and as for the badge wearers. I'd say make that badge be a place holder for the 'member' waiver. in which they sign a blanket waiver that says i hereby am aware of all game rules for all game areas and am responsible for my own actions for the rest of my airsofting life. or something. just throwing ideas around. i am not apposed to signing the each game waiver. just a thought in a direction.

in closing like i said. im just an interested airsofter who enjoys playing and doesn't think about legal.. not my department kinda thing.

thoughts?

The badge as a 'permanent waiver' is a good idea. But we must be wary of creating a definite NIA entity that can be sued. I fear that tying anything legal to the patch (i.e. waiver) would set up those folks for other things legal (i.e. lawsuit). Just a thought...

If someone wants to make up players tags around the sNe size as the existing ones that only have a location on them I can start changing player tags so they don't say nia member.

We may be able to help with that this weekend..Wait one.

Even just a slight edit of what exists then each club can make their own around the same size.

ok, how about this:

http://airsoftbc.com/tags1.jpg

link is dead

Sorry...doing some server work.

Try here:

http://temp2.airsoftbc.com/tags1.jpg

The old link will be back up shortly once I am done messing with stuff.

Do we want the member line on there or just NIA 100 Mile, Chetwynd etc. Then folks can start of default as a new player with their tag and once they come to enough games they get the area tag.

It helps the differant communities of the NIA to see WHERE everyone if from, at a glance whether they are a NIA member officially or not (new player).

Frankly I think, at a player level, region is considered first, then their NIA Status.

Why? Because the smaller the community the more important representation becomes.

Let me this put another way...A new player reads a poster, comes to the site, but sees no one from his area, so quits or drives to PG for games, thinking there is no one here from his area, when in fact there maybe many doing the same thing as him.

Each participants first contribution is by location, then time in so everyone should get a location tag at the very least.

Is it now up to each area to set wether a person is a member of that area? The would keep the NIA as a larger entity free from members.

Does the leadership of that area make the call and the admin from that area do the tag changing?

That seems to match what we have changed for the rules etc.

Ya that does make sense. Basically once the holder of the local badges hands one out to a player, then they update the player tag too.